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homage or rip-off?

ripoff

Ah yes, the never ending debate about where the line gets crossed! What exactly is the difference between being traditional and being unoriginal? Between spoofing and appropriating? Does the web inherently cause ripoffs because it is different from print media? Or is there just a proportional increase related to more images being out there?
Check it out – a blog for lookalikes. In this case we assume the ad ripped off the wall, but maybe, just maybe, the artist got compensated. The (original?) wall art is posted somewhere on ekosystem, a blog of street art that looks quite worthy of our attention too.

  • http://otherthings.com/ otherthings

    This reminds me of Don Hertzfeld’s hilarious account of his brush with the advertising world.

  • http://otherthings.com otherthings

    This reminds me of Don Hertzfeld’s hilarious account of his brush with the advertising world.

  • pdxpletive

    Great link. Don Hertzfeld is the best.

    The post reminded me of the current brouhaha over a certain t-shirt-selling “artist”:

    http://www.miketyndall.com/todd_goldman/

    I was actually poking around Drawn! last night looking for mention of this dust-up, funny coincidence.

  • pdxpletive

    Great link. Don Hertzfeld is the best.

    The post reminded me of the current brouhaha over a certain t-shirt-selling “artist”:

    http://www.miketyndall.com/todd_goldman/

    I was actually poking around Drawn! last night looking for mention of this dust-up, funny coincidence.

  • pdxpletive

    Silly me, there’s mention of the very same controversy right on the youthoughtwewouldntnotice.com page. So, yeah, more than a coincidence I’m guessing.

  • pdxpletive

    Silly me, there’s mention of the very same controversy right on the youthoughtwewouldntnotice.com page. So, yeah, more than a coincidence I’m guessing.

  • Sarasvati48

    I worked for a sign painter for a while. She frequently looked to the work of other folk for ideas. She said the law was if you changed 5 things in the original, it was okay. For instance, she used the pirate from the liquor ad for a local water park with a pirate-themed ride for a “must be this high” plaque…

  • Sarasvati48

    I worked for a sign painter for a while. She frequently looked to the work of other folk for ideas. She said the law was if you changed 5 things in the original, it was okay. For instance, she used the pirate from the liquor ad for a local water park with a pirate-themed ride for a “must be this high” plaque…

  • http://www.charlenechua.com/ sygnin

    You know, sometimes clients will pull out artwork and show it to me and say ‘well we like this but we can’t find/ can’t afford/ don’t get along with the original artist, can you do something like it’. I don’t think it’s completely ethical, but at the same time I don’t think it’s a complete crime especially if you try to make it different. Of course then you get the odd art director who insists you try and mimic the original as closely as possible, and there’s the rent to pay…

    Anyway, with regards to the piece above, I’d say it was referenced but it’s not copied. It’s not something I would be personally proud of but I wouldn’t crucify anyone for it either (the face in particular looks different in both pieces. Frankly the ad version is an improvement to me). I’ve been ripped off before in whole (my piece was used by some software company, Starware, who claimed they couldn’t do a thing about it), so in a sense I would much rather someone do an original piece based off something I did, rather than steal the work wholesale.

  • http://www.charlenechua.com sygnin

    You know, sometimes clients will pull out artwork and show it to me and say ‘well we like this but we can’t find/ can’t afford/ don’t get along with the original artist, can you do something like it’. I don’t think it’s completely ethical, but at the same time I don’t think it’s a complete crime especially if you try to make it different. Of course then you get the odd art director who insists you try and mimic the original as closely as possible, and there’s the rent to pay…

    Anyway, with regards to the piece above, I’d say it was referenced but it’s not copied. It’s not something I would be personally proud of but I wouldn’t crucify anyone for it either (the face in particular looks different in both pieces. Frankly the ad version is an improvement to me). I’ve been ripped off before in whole (my piece was used by some software company, Starware, who claimed they couldn’t do a thing about it), so in a sense I would much rather someone do an original piece based off something I did, rather than steal the work wholesale.

  • http://www.davecurd.com/ davecurd

    This is a shame. Legally, they are in the clear, as it’s redrawn and fairly different. Small changes. But ethicly? Yuck. There are no homages in advertising, only ripoffs. Distasteful.

    Sygnin-
    “so in a sense I would much rather someone do an original piece based off something I did, rather than steal the work wholesale”
    I guess it’s a tastebud thing, but not me. If it was ripped from my website, livetraced and applied, I could say “This is lame, but they are obviously broke punk bitches”. I’d still sick the reps on’em, just to be sure. ;)
    But to see that another artist was commissioned to copy my work? For me, that burns worse as there is %100 certainty that someone was compensated for their “work”.

  • http://www.davecurd.com davecurd

    This is a shame. Legally, they are in the clear, as it’s redrawn and fairly different. Small changes. But ethicly? Yuck. There are no homages in advertising, only ripoffs. Distasteful.

    Sygnin-
    “so in a sense I would much rather someone do an original piece based off something I did, rather than steal the work wholesale”
    I guess it’s a tastebud thing, but not me. If it was ripped from my website, livetraced and applied, I could say “This is lame, but they are obviously broke punk bitches”. I’d still sick the reps on’em, just to be sure. ;)
    But to see that another artist was commissioned to copy my work? For me, that burns worse as there is %100 certainty that someone was compensated for their “work”.

  • pdxpletive

    Interesting, I’m surprised to see any tolerance at all for the copying in the above image. Certainly the head is different, and the linework on the body isn’t a perfect match, but it’s recognizably the *same body*. It’s like saying I could take a picture of Donald Duck, change his head, and trace over it and call it my work… I really don’t think that would fly. Actually, I could see it working in fine art, where it would probably fall under fair use as a quote, but that would be OK in large part perhaps because DD is a recognizable icon. I would not, however, be able to turn it into a new and unique IP (like say, Marky Mallard, the head of Mark Wahlberg on the body of Donald Duck… eew) and then sell it as if I was the author.

    That was my problem in the case I linked to, where the guy appears to be pillaging relatively obscure art and design from all over the web, mixing it up, and then pimping it as his own product line.

  • pdxpletive

    Interesting, I’m surprised to see any tolerance at all for the copying in the above image. Certainly the head is different, and the linework on the body isn’t a perfect match, but it’s recognizably the *same body*. It’s like saying I could take a picture of Donald Duck, change his head, and trace over it and call it my work… I really don’t think that would fly. Actually, I could see it working in fine art, where it would probably fall under fair use as a quote, but that would be OK in large part perhaps because DD is a recognizable icon. I would not, however, be able to turn it into a new and unique IP (like say, Marky Mallard, the head of Mark Wahlberg on the body of Donald Duck… eew) and then sell it as if I was the author.

    That was my problem in the case I linked to, where the guy appears to be pillaging relatively obscure art and design from all over the web, mixing it up, and then pimping it as his own product line.

  • http://exploded.awcr.org/ kurren
  • http://exploded.awcr.org kurren
  • uns3en

    First post btw! ;)

    Have anyone ever thought maybe it is THE SAME ARTIST? Just because he makes graffiti, doesn’t make him/her as criminal. He/she might be working at some ad agency and, when they need some urban creditability, artist made graffiti that is almost like his normal graffiti, but bit different, just to give hint for urban crowd? And btw. have anyone seen graffitiartist KAWS toys? KAWS-mickey is like body of mickey mouse and head of KAWS monster…

  • uns3en

    First post btw! ;)

    Have anyone ever thought maybe it is THE SAME ARTIST? Just because he makes graffiti, doesn’t make him/her as criminal. He/she might be working at some ad agency and, when they need some urban creditability, artist made graffiti that is almost like his normal graffiti, but bit different, just to give hint for urban crowd? And btw. have anyone seen graffitiartist KAWS toys? KAWS-mickey is like body of mickey mouse and head of KAWS monster…

  • http://www.life-in-austin.com/ xadrian

    I’m with pdx, it’s a layup. Swipe! Be done with it. Someone go after them. Come on -artists- let’s not stand for this.

  • http://www.life-in-austin.com xadrian

    I’m with pdx, it’s a layup. Swipe! Be done with it. Someone go after them. Come on -artists- let’s not stand for this.

  • http://www.fotolog.com/lohees/ Ouikid

    Rip-Off !
    The artist is named Btoy and he didn’t have any “compensation”, there’s a topic on Ekosystem about it :
    http://www.ekosystem.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3822&highlight=nissan

    :)

  • http://www.fotolog.com/lohees/ Ouikid

    Rip-Off !
    The artist is named Btoy and he didn’t have any “compensation”, there’s a topic on Ekosystem about it :
    http://www.ekosystem.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3822&highlight=nissan

    :)

  • Ariel

    Looking like, “even if slightly” to an original… is purely unethical. As an artist, i’d hate to have anything of mine “slightly” copied(*even if just a doodle)

    But that’s just me.. and unfortunately not how business sees things.

  • Ariel

    Looking like, “even if slightly” to an original… is purely unethical. As an artist, i’d hate to have anything of mine “slightly” copied(*even if just a doodle)

    But that’s just me.. and unfortunately not how business sees things.

  • http://www.groveartworks.com/ jaleen

    Ouikid, thank you for hunting up the link. I was too pressed for time to search any further for it (lame, but true….)

  • http://www.groveartworks.com jaleen

    Ouikid, thank you for hunting up the link. I was too pressed for time to search any further for it (lame, but true….)